Birthdays, COVID, and Reframing (Oh My!)
Discuss the year of the coronavirus and the good and bad sides with Gabe and Lisa.
(Transcript available below)
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About the not crazy podcast hosts
Gabe Howard is an award-winning writer and public speaker living with bipolar disorder. He is the author of the popular book, Insanity is an asshole and other observations, available from Amazon; signed copies are also available directly from Gabe Howard. To learn more, please visit his website, gabehoward.com.
Lisa is the producer of the Psych Central podcast Not Crazy. She is the recipient of the National Alliance on Mental Illness' Above and Beyond award, has worked extensively with the Ohio Peer Supporter Certification program, and is a workplace suicide prevention trainer. Lisa has battled depression her entire life and has partnered with Gabe for over a decade to advocate mental health. She lives in Columbus, Ohio with her husband. enjoys international travel; and orders 12 pairs of shoes online, chooses the best and sends the other 11 back.
Computer generated transcript for "Birthdays, COVID” episode
Editor's note:: Please note that this transcript was computer generated and therefore may contain inaccuracies and grammatical errors. Many thanks.
Lisa: Y.You're listening to Not Crazy, a Psych Central podcast hosted by my ex-husband with bipolar disorder. Together we created the Mental Health Podcast for People Who Hate Mental Health Podcasts.
Gift: Hello everyone, and welcome to this week's Not Crazy podcast. I am your hostess, Gabe Howard, and with me, as always, in a good mood, Lisa Kiner.
Lisa: Today's quote is from Jeremy Mortis. Age is not just a number. Aging is a collection of experiences and life lessons that will give you wisdom.
Gift: I think this is really the erosion of facts because age is indeed a number. The age of something is how old something is. My car is seven years old. No, your car has wisdom. No only,
Lisa: I
Gift: Seven years old.
Lisa: I think you're taking this a little literally. It's supposed to be encouraging because people get depressed because of aging.
Gift: Right, it's another example of a convenient lie that is better than an inconvenient truth. People get depressed about it. Instead of telling them that they are closer to death, we will tell them that they are wise. Right, because old people are revered in our society. What was the last time
Lisa: Well, something like that.
Gift: Some, like a woman, were in the supermarket and she literally took the entire aisle and stopped for no reason. And people said it was wisdom. Look at this.
Lisa: Well, to be fair, when you are 20 and you do that, people behave very differently towards you than when you are 80 and you do.
Gift: You have been doing this since you were 20 years old. I remember when you said there was nothing worse than a middle-aged woman and that makes me so proud.
Lisa: What did i say
Gift: There is nothing worse than a middle-aged woman. They think they know everything. Your motherhood cult, the motherhood cult.
Lisa: That's a different concept.
Gift: The point I'm making Lisa is that you've never looked at someone older than you and thought they were smarter.
Lisa: For one thing, I don't think that's the case because if you've done something that I haven't done yet, you obviously have more information on the matter and.
Gift: But that doesn't depend on their age, but on their experience.
Lisa: No, but you have to assume that people older than you have better chances.
Gift: Really, is that what you go with? You might be smarter so will I respect you? This is
Lisa: No,
Gift: Abdication of the facts
Lisa: No,
Gift: Completely.
Lisa: Ok you get off topic and I feel like you are distracting. The reason we come here today is because it's time for Gabe's annual birthday party. Happy birthday gift.
Gift: Ok, first of all it's not a festival.
Lisa: What would you call it
Gift: I dont know
Lisa: Tradition?
Gift: For sure. Let's go with the tradition and see a little context before we start. Back in 2014, when I was a blogger, I wrote a blog called "I'm Bipolar" and it's my birthday. It was only
Lisa: He's so good at titles
Gift: Yeah, I'm great at titles, right.
Lisa: Just pull yourself in, I want to read that now.
Gift: But people did and it was popular. And a year later I wrote another. And then I don't know how these things work. It became a kind of tradition. So here we are. And I think, OK, well, I'm a podcaster, now I want to do something around my birthday. Lisa said you know you have your own show and you can pick any theme you want and booming, here we are. What will hopefully be the first year I'm bipolar and it's my birthday podcast series. It started as a blog in 2014.
Lisa: That's a change because on every other blog, and I've reread them all to prepare for today, you're actually saying things like, well, I'll never do that again. It won't just happen. Yes. So wow, you actually commit to doing another one of these next year?
Gift: I don't know, I think it's one of them
Lisa: They are not what we call future planners.
Gift: I don't have people for it.
Lisa: Yes I understand.
Gift: That's why you're my people.
Lisa: Ok, to sum it up, the point is that your birthday tradition is to bring something into the world. Happy Birthday.
Gift: Yes, happy birthday by the way.
Lisa: The reason it's especially weird is because our birthdays are just a few days apart. Someone wishes me a happy birthday?
Gift: Happy birthday, happy birthday, unsung heroine Lisa, happy birthday. It's very meaningful because you made me do it.
Lisa: I feel like I have to work this down, so you really should have said it faster.
Gift: Happy birthday, happy birthday.
Lisa: Oh God.
Gift: Happy birthday, dear unsung heroine, Lisa, happy birthday. Get to the meat of it. Your idea, Lisa, to accomplish the whole thing was that you would interview me
Lisa: Correct.
Gift: Over the past year. I am glad you chose 2020. I want to summarize.
Lisa: OK.
Gift: I think a summary is needed. I turned 43 in 2019. Christmas was decent. You know, January was pretty good. I have no complaints about February, March. Here we are.
Lisa: And that sums up the year. Yay.
Gift: Thank you for checking out this week's Not Crazy podcast if you enjoyed it.
Lisa: I read all of your blogs and if you read them in a row it is a little bit scary.
Gift: It's depressing what it is.
Lisa: Yes it is, yes it is, but this is your fault. The first is pretty positive. Oh, I'm looking forward to another year of stability with bipolar disorder. Then downhill. What has changed? Why is the first positive and after that you are only downfall and darkness on every birthday?
Gift: Of course I wrote them all a year apart, but when Insanity is an asshole and other observations After the publisher was published, he decided to put each article side by side. Instead of reading them every year or if you read them online, read one and then have 51 other blogs, they are literally back to back.
Lisa: It's interesting to read them one by one, it's a different experience.
Gift: And if you read them one after the other, you really see that
Lisa: The topics.
Gift: The subjects come out. I remember saying in one of them I hate my birthday. And then when I turned 40 I wrote you know I never hated my birthday until this year. That clearly contradicts. What the hell? Am i a flip flopper? Am i a hypocrite
Lisa: No, strangely enough, you remember the past through rose-colored glasses, because every single one you say something about was worse this year than last year. The last year has been so good. Everything was fine before. This year it just got shit. But you say that every year.
Gift: Yes.
Lisa: Apparently they only find joy in retrospect or look back with a completely different perspective than they did then. It's a little weird and kind of disturbing and sad. Mostly sad.
Gift: If you haven't checked out Insanity is an asshole and other observationsYou can of course also buy it from Amazon. You can go too gabehoward.com and grab it. But it's very interesting. Me, it was painful not to update this. It was painful to see what is basically just blatant hypocrisy on the site. But I agree with Lisa. I think it's an interesting look into my mind that is a little compromised. Even though I am in recovery and being treated, I still am who I am and I still have bipolar disorder and anxiety. And of course that brings with it all of the symptoms, mania, depression, etc. And reading these things one after the other really showed me that there is so much to do. I think that was one of the silver linings that came out of the book because, as you remember, Lisa, I wasn't very excited about the book. I dont know. I have just.
Lisa: You have lost enthusiasm for the project. Getting something takes much, much longer than you think. And you lost your excitement before you finished.
Gift: I just found it arrogant to sell a book of things I wrote because why would anyone want that? I just thought, why should people pay for it? That makes no sense. I am really glad that the publisher saw value in it. I mean, it worked out great. I
Lisa: You should all be working on it by now.
Gift: Thank you, Lisa.
Lisa: You're welcome. The very first blog was positive, but things went downhill after that. And some of them summarize your achievements from the previous year. So let's do that, because we'll start here happily. What did you achieve in the past year, Gabe? Share with our listeners.
Gift: Not many, I mean, COVID really kind of ruined everything. I suppose a great achievement I have is that I think anyone who listens should do themselves credit, a global pandemic hasn't stopped me. It didn't stop Lisa, it didn't stop my friends, my wife. It didn't stop anyone from listening to this podcast. And as much as I want to say, well, it stopped me, it stopped me from doing the following things that I wanted to do. Yes, it stopped a lot of people from doing a lot of the things they wanted to do, but it didn't stop us. Forward. Momentum was made. It's true. I didn't get a lot of things that I wanted. And honestly, I didn't get a lot of things that I needed. But I've had enough. Correct?
Lisa: OK,
Gift: I have enough
Lisa: OK.
Gift: I pushed myself forward enough. I want to pat myself and all of my listeners and all of our fans and all of our friends and family. And you, Lisa, I want to do you credit because we're still standing. I'm still standing despite a global pandemic.
Lisa: It was a difficult month.
Gift: It's been a terrible couple of months.
Lisa: Well, it's been over a couple of months.
Gift: Do you remember when we thought it would be two to four weeks?
Lisa: Yes Yes Yes. In June I read this article that said, Hey, this is going to be like September 11th, where even after the immediate aftermath there is a permanent impact that will last forever in American society. And I thought, oh my god, this is so profound. Yes here we are Now is November.
Gift: This pandemic was really what it is like to be diagnosed with a mental illness. This is the example everyone should use with their friends and family who don't understand because this really bad thing happened, right? We were all sitting around in mid-March and someone said listen there is a global pandemic very analogous to listening. You have severe depression, bipolar disorder, anxiety disorders, schizophrenia, psychosis. Correct. So a global pandemic is really bad news. Can we all agree on that?
Lisa: OK, so the analogy is that both are bad news. Here we begin our analogy, Gabe.
Gift: Thank you for repeating exactly what I said but calling it a summary, yes, that is exactly what happened.
Lisa: That's a summary.
Gift: But it is not. You used my exact words. Yes, everyone has bad news. But similar to a severe and ongoing mental health diagnosis, we all thought, OK, we're going to buckle up and do what it takes. This will be over before we know.
Lisa: Oh,
Gift: Correct. This is.
Lisa: I didn't trust this analogy, but I see where you are going. Ok, forget it. I take back my previous skepticism.
Gift: Yes. Yeah the whole world was like, I understand what a global pandemic is, yeah, no, you don't. Just as I understand what bipolar disorder is. Yes no you don't.
Lisa: Yes, good analogy.
Gift: And we all buckled up and started doing the right things. Correct. We think, OK, we're only going to do this for a few months and it will be fine. But then the treatment changed. I'm from Ohio, full disclosure. And the first treatment was social distancing. And then the next treatment was that we were going to close restaurants. And then the next treatment was, hey, we're going to close salons and fitness centers. And then we will close all shopping centers for the next treatment. And it's like I don't.
Lisa: We had a complete shutdown here in Ohio.
Gift: Yes and.
Lisa: It took about six weeks.
Gift: Right, but it didn't happen right away, did it? Once again I was diagnosed with bipolar disorder and got treatment and I think that's it that will solve this problem. And then I got worse and worse and lasted longer and longer. Just like the global pandemic, we have all been diagnosed with a global pandemic and we all thought we knew what it was even though we didn't. And then we got the first treatment. We think it will be over in four to six weeks, which it wasn't. And then we got another treatment. We are like no problem. After that, it'll be over in four to six weeks. But then it wasn't over. And then we got another treatment. And then everyone around us started giving us their opinion on the global pandemic, even though they weren't qualified to do so. You know, when you get mental illness, suddenly everyone around you becomes a psychologist, a therapist, a psychiatrist. Just like suddenly in the global pandemic, everyone became an infectious disease expert. All of these people just emerged from the woodworks to tell you what they did wrong to tackle the global pandemic.
Gift: Where? Are you qualified for it? Just like with mental illness. Hey what do you do for a living I dig trenches. Oh ok. But let me tell you how, with all the confidence as a medical school graduate, you can deal with your severe and persistent mental illness. Would you like to know what I learned this year? I've learned that people will push their limits with way too much confidence. And when someone tells you something will be over in four to six weeks, they're lying. From now until the end of time. When I ask someone a question and they're around four to six weeks old, bullshit. I'll just scream bullshit and run out of the room. Yes, because four to six weeks mean a year and it's still not over and we still can't agree. And stigma is everywhere. The stigma of global pandemics is pervasive. If you wear the mask you are a sucker. If you don't wear the mask, you are a sucker. If you wear the mask, you support, I don't even know what's going on anymore.
Lisa: OK,
Gift: See? Do you see the analogy, Lisa?
Lisa: I.
Gift: Do you see how the worldwide global pandemic and severe and persistent mental illness are exactly alike? I'm really looking forward to being 44 years old in this environment. I can not
Lisa: OK.
Gift: Even a party. Where is my
Lisa: OK,
Gift: Party?
Lisa: There is so much going on there, just so much.
Gift: I am calm now.
Lisa: This is a good analogy in that when we were first diagnosed with bipolar disorder we all thought, OK, you need to treat this, you will get your treatment under control, and then things will go back to being exactly how they were yesterday or
Gift: Yes,
Lisa: A couple of weeks earlier.
Gift: That is what I have been waiting for.
Lisa: You're going to take these pills, you're going to let yourself regulate. And in a few months we'll be back to where we were before this diagnosis. We'll be normal again. And of course that didn't happen. And every single new thing that came up down the line we thought, okay, this is the one. I mean, yeah, the last one didn't work. But this will be the one that we will get back to normal in a few months. Oh, the second didn't work. Well, the third and we had full bloody faith every single time. We never said we hadn't gotten back to normal the last five times. We still believed that this would happen. That's a good analogy to the idea that it's just this ongoing thing, and you keep thinking that the next step will be the one that ends it. But the reality is that things never got back to normal. We did that where you have a new normal. You never did what you did before the diagnosis.
Gift: I feel like you're saying that things are just different now.
Lisa: Things are different now. They never went back to what it was before. This was a profound change in your life. Nothing was like before. Excellent analogies all round.
Gift: Don't forget all of the folks who come out of the woodworks to tell you you're doing it wrong and they know best even though they literally have no experience, training, or formal education.
Lisa: Not as good as an analogy, but not bad. Also true. Yeah it was amazing how many people showed up to say, well, you know. Mostly to tell you that mental illness was bullshit. Occasionally it has been a miracle to tell you about a random person you know.
Gift: Really, don't you really see it as analogous to the global pandemic?
Lisa: I.
Gift: No miraculous treatments were offered that turned out to be utter nonsense offered by anyone? You can't imagine anyone standing at a podium and saying: Sunshine shine on it, put bleach on it, Hydro Cordo pen will fix it? Really can't imagine anyone offering bullshit treatments for the world to follow that they didn't take when they got sick? "Really?" Nobody? Can't you imagine nobody doing this?
Lisa: I feel like
Gift: Nobody?
Lisa: I'm talking about
Gift: Nobody?
Lisa: And you interrupt
Gift: Nobody?
Lisa: Me and
Gift: Nobody?
Lisa: I'm getting into trouble
Gift: Nobody?
Lisa: My thoughts are organized here.
Gift: Nobody? Can't think of anyone?
Lisa: And you don't help.
Gift: Well. Go on.
Lisa: Lots of people who gave advice. Yes, their advice was stupid. They had no experience with it. And it was mostly in the sense of a mental illness that is not real. But then there was another wave of people offering advice, OK, mental illness is definitely real. And here is what my second cousin's friend's roommate did and what completely resolved it for him. This will of course be perfect for you too. A large number of them were just stupid, acupuncture, colloidal silver, the various vitamins. But even those who were actually real like, he does the following medication regimen. He does the following type of therapy. That was actually good advice, hey, this is something that actually has a chance to work. But not everyone with bipolar disorder is created equal. Not all advice applies to everyone alike. I don't see it in the same way as you do. For example, other countries have many opinions about how America should solve this problem, and most of them have solved it. So it's not exactly the same.
Gift: There are no perfect analogies, I'm not trying to say that the global pandemic and the diagnosis of mental illness are exactly the same, that would be ridiculous. But the similarities are there.
Lisa: You are.
Gift: It's serious. People die, but some people get better too. You know that was often a criticism of the mental health advocacy, right? Oh why are we so worried about this? Most people live well. Good yes. And then we ignore the homeless. Then we ignore really, really sick people who don't have insurance because everyone just keeps tracking down Gabe Howard. Look, Gabe is fine. I guess it's not that serious. I understand that some people use my success as a reason not to help exceptionally vulnerable people.
Lisa: Yeah OK that's a good analogy, all the people who say I have COVID and I'm fine, I've never had any symptoms. I'm fine. Yeah, OK, good analogy.
Gift: I don't know anyone with COVID. Do you know anyone with COVID? Gosh, that sounds a lot like I don't know any mentally ill people. Do you know people with mental illness? Or my personal favorite, you know, the only people to worry about is people who are already sick or old. Yes. Gosh, that sounds a lot like the only people who have to worry about mental illness are people who are in danger anyway or come from broken homes or lots of trauma.
Lisa: Yes.
Gift: First of all, it is not true. It's not just old or immunocompromised people who die from COVID. People died of COVID who are perfectly fine and then got COVID. And yes, it didn't go their way. Just like there are people who come from great homes. Remember my parents love me. They are not alcoholics who hit me every day. They are perfectly good people who did the best they could. Your son just had bipolar disorder. Gosh, what happened to it all? The only people with mental illness are people whose parents beat them, right? We say these things to comfort ourselves.
Lisa: You're really good at analogies, you really pull in a lot here that I didn't see coming, so yay on the. We could talk about COVID for days and we have it, like probably everyone in the world. We have to bring this back to your birthday, OK? The blogs always had something of your achievements. And what you are telling me is that there isn't much going on in your professional life this year due to COVID, but you still had some banner events.
Gift: Sure, what were they?
Lisa: You have been invited.
Gift: I started Not Crazy twice
Lisa: I agree. And you have a new co-host.
Gift: I have two new co-hosts. I started Not Crazy with the great Jackie Zimmerman and then COVID just threw it away. And then I got another co-host, the great Lisa Kiner, who didn't want it but said good. You know, that really describes this year for me. It's good. I have that. It's good. It's not that things aren't going well. Lisa, I love working with you, but let's be honest, there was a lack of enthusiasm for the project. It was nice.
Lisa: First or now? Because I'm very excited, look, listen, I exude excitement at this point, Gabe. I'm so excited, but of course nobody asks me about my performance, even though it's actually my birthday. But that's fine. I am not bitter.
Gift: Lisa, what were your successes this year? Share things about your personal life that you can later cut out because you believe your parents will hear and dislike.
Lisa: It's not just my parents. I just don't feel like I should be sharing that much on the internet, so becoming a podcaster was clearly a brilliant idea.
Gift: I just want people to know that the reason I don't ask Lisa questions is because I ask Lisa questions and she cuts them out later because she is uncomfortable sharing them.
Lisa: You knew that about me in advance. All of these people, all of the years that you ask for your phone number at the checkout, there's no need for these people to have my phone number. That is unnecessary.
Gift: No, I think this is just an indication of a different way I feel and have felt this year. I'm not trying to attack you. I love you. You are my beast
Lisa: I love you too. Pay attention.
Gift: But you damn well know you do. You know that damn well
Lisa: Yes.
Gift: You fake the Oh, I can't get a word on my lips.
Lisa: I am not pretending.
Gift: I want everyone to know that Lisa Kiner has no problem standing up for herself. Notice,
Lisa: Oh yes of course.
Gift: This is the woman who brought me to treatment and single-handedly beat up bipolar disorder for me. And
Lisa: Oh.
Gift: Now she's like this, oh, I can't beat Gabe. "Really?" You can accept the disease in my head, but you can't beat its host?
Lisa: That's so cute, these are so nice things that you say. However, they are not on the subject.
Gift: I haven't strayed from the subject. That was my year.
Lisa: OK.
Gift: The annual bipolar birthday blog was always over the year.
Lisa: Well.
Gift: Everything I said happened this year. I don't think you understand how my blogs work.
Lisa: So you don't have a lot of professional things to say about this year, like many people, you've been slowed down by COVID. Well, there are many things happening in your personal life that have been excellent this year. Why don't we focus on some of these?
Gift: Ok, I almost murdered my wife.
Lisa: COVID was difficult to stay at home.
Gift: I want everyone to know, not literally.
Lisa: Does that really have to be said?
Gift: Look, I don't want anyone to hear this and say, oh, the man with bipolar disorder was almost violent. It is sad once again that it has to be said. But yeah, look, I love my wife very much, but I never intended to hang out with her 24/7. My wife had to work from home and on the one hand I am very happy that I was able to be isolated and alone. I have many single friends who would be so happy to be upset by a roommate, parent, or spouse. I really get it. The grass is greener on the other side, I think man I wish I lived alone now and my wife feels that way too. I'm not telling her anything that she doesn't know. We're not hurting each other here. We're just, we'd work all day and then at the end of the day get together and share our war stories, we'd vent one another. The saga of our idiot coworkers is simple, those were our favorite reality shows. All of these shows have been canceled.
Lisa: I have a feeling that most of your employees are geniuses. I just don't know if you are aware of it.
Gift: You know, in the age of Healthline.com, I've found some amazing employees that really go a long way in masking the employee's anger that I had before Healthline. I'm not going to make names here, but my previous collaborator was very difficult. It's still difficult. But now that Psych Central is selling to Healthline.com, I now have more employees to dilute the previous annoying employee.
Lisa: And we'll be right back.
announcer: Would you like to learn about psychology and mental health from experts in the field? Listen to the Psych Central Podcast hosted by Gabe Howard. visit PsychCentral.com/Show or subscribe to the Psych Central Podcast on your favorite podcast player.
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Gabe: Hey, alle zusammen, wir diskutieren wieder über meinen Geburtstag.
Lisa: Weißt du, jetzt, wo ich darüber nachdenke, als ich sagte, liste deine beruflichen Erfolge auf. Warum hast du als erstes nicht gesagt: Oh, du und ich haben einen Podcast bekommen? Wieso war das nicht das allererste, was aus deinem Mund kam? Und das geschah auch im März.
Gabe: Ach du lieber Gott.
Lisa: Oh mein Gott, wir haben COVID ausgelöst.
Gabe: Oh.
Lisa: Nicht wirklich.
Gabe: Ah.
Lisa: Vorsichtig. Sie werden eine Art Internet-Verschwörungstheorie in Gang bringen.
Gabe: Nun, das ist heutzutage nicht schwer.
Lisa: Nun, an dem Tag, an dem ich verabredet war und der Mann zu mir sagte, hey, wussten Sie, dass Henry Kissinger das AIDS-Virus in einem Labor verursacht hat? Und ich dachte, wow, ich brauche dich nicht mehr zu treffen, aber.
Gabe: Weißt du, mein Lieblingsteil dieser Geschichte, es dauerte noch einen Monat, bis ihr euch getrennt habt.
Lisa: Er war heiß.
Gabe: Ich beschuldige dich nicht.
Lisa: Er war dumm heiß. OK, ich meine, im Ernst, dieser Typ war so heiß, ich weiß nicht, warum er so dumm war und es war nicht sofort klar, wie dumm er war. Ich meine, du musstest ein bisschen mit ihm reden. Aber um fair zu sein, mussten Sie nicht so viel mit ihm sprechen, um zur AIDS-Sache mit Henry Kissinger zu gelangen. Gott, dieser Typ war heiß. Wie auch immer, ich gehe zurück.
Gabe: Nein, nein, ich möchte nur eine kurze Sache über die Bindung von Gabe und Lisa sagen, denn die Anzahl der dummen Leute, mit denen ich mich verabredet habe, weil sie verrückt heiß waren, ist nur eine phänomenale Zahl. Weil ich nur wirklich dumme Leute hasse. Und dann traf ich Lisa und wir verbanden uns über diesen gegenseitigen Hass auf vorsätzliche Ignoranz und Dummheit. Und dann gaben beide zu, dass wir uns mit verrückten heißen Leuten verabredet haben, die wir einfach nicht mochten. Und ich denke, dies war ein großer Moment in meinem Lernen über Feminismus, weil ich dachte, dass Frauen darüber liegen. Und Sie dachten, warum um alles in der Welt würden Sie das glauben?
Lisa: Dass Frauen es nicht mögen, mit heißen Männern auszugehen?
Gabe: Das sind dumm
Lisa: Well.
Gabe: Nein, nein, ich wusste, dass Frauen heiße Jungs mögen. Ich dachte nur, wenn der Mann dumm wäre, dass Frauen wie Sie so wären, würde ich nicht mit Ihnen ausgehen. Du bist dumm.
Lisa: Apropos Geburtstage, als ich älter geworden bin, bin ich natürlich jetzt verheiratet, also denke ich, dass es irrelevant ist. Aber als ich älter wurde, tat ich das immer weniger. Weißt du, heiße Leute sind ein Dutzend, aber Leute, mit denen man reden kann, die viel schwerer zu finden und attraktiver sind.
Gabe: Ein weiterer Moment in der großen Werbung für Lisa und Gabe
Lisa: Uh-huh.
Gabe: Als ich Lisa fragte, ob ich heiß sei und sie sagte: Oh mein Gott, Intelligenz ist so sexy. I said I meant physically and you’re like, you know, smart. Just the way that you think is so amazing. I’m like, once again my physical appearance and she’s like, you know, your personality.
Lisa: So attractive.
Gabe: Oh, the charisma that you exude. I didn’t press it after that, but I’m pretty sure you said I was ugly.
Lisa: I do not remember this conversation
Gabe: Does any of that sound wrong to you?
Lisa: That does sound like something I would say yes,
Gabe: Yeah, yeah.
Lisa: And I maintain smart is incredibly sexy. Yeah.
Gabe: And you know what else is incredibly sexy?
Lisa: My husband.
Gabe: Sexy. Really, we got to bring Viroj into this?
Lisa: Who is super smart, and hot.
Gabe: You know, he’s going to listen to this episode and he’s like, why? Why did you pull me into this?
Lisa: I just felt like I should.
Gabe: Kendall always tells me, Kendall is my wife, and Kendall is like, why did you drag me into your fight? Like, No, I want you to keep your codependency delusional podcast bullshit over there. Like, keep it over there. Don’t drag me into this. And to tie it back to my birthday, that’s been the year. She has been drug into more things this year because we both work from home and I have been drug into more things. See it used to be when Kendall would get in a fight with a coworker, by the time we got together, it’d be hours old. She had time to think about it, process it, form the narrative, maybe get resolution. That hasn’t happened this year. And it’s made it very difficult. I hear her on the phone and then I walk downstairs and she starts telling me about it. And I, I sort of feel obligated to listen. Or something bad will happen that I want to rant about, rave about, bitch about whatever words you want to use. But rather than it be finely tuned at the end of the day, Kendall’s watching it in real time. We’re experiencing it together. These things never hit Gabe and Kendall together before. They always hit us separately and then we would use each other as support at the end of the day. I don’t like this.
Lisa: Nobody likes this, we all want to get out of the house, Gabe.
Gabe: I don’t like it.
Lisa: You’re not alone, you’re not special. Everybody
Gabe: I don’t like it
Lisa: Wants out of the house.
Gabe: I want out of the house.
Lisa: I need concerts and live entertainment to come back.
Gabe: Yes,
Lisa: I’m so bored.
Gabe: Yeah, that’s the other thing. What do we talk about? You know, Kendall and I used to talk about sporting events, concerts. We used to go to festivals. We love festivals, the vendors, the local artists, local music, local comedians. Kendall and I loved this. For one, it’s amazing. And two, it’s relatively inexpensive. You know, the arts festival in Columbus, Ohio, is free. We would meet all of these local artists. We’d see this beautiful art and we would go with Lisa and Lisa’s husband.
Lisa: We go every year. I was disappointed when it was canceled this year.
Gabe: The most amazing thing that happens is, Lisa, we have differing tastes on art, so I would look at this this piece of art and I’d be like, that is incredibly beautiful. And Lisa would be like, that is hideous and ugly. Keep it out of my house and.
Lisa: No, you would say, oh, my God, isn’t this amazing, this is great. I must have this in my house right now. And I’d be like, yeah, it’s all right. It looks like something you’d see in a motel.
Gabe: And then Lisa bought what can best be described.
Lisa: I have amazing taste.
Gabe: As a medieval weapon, it’s made of steel?
Lisa: Oh, yeah, I enjoy sculptures. I like that.
Gabe: It’s large and heavy. In her old condo, it hung above her fireplace. She just recently moved. So we don’t know where this 17th century medieval weaponry will be, but it’s not. It’s a sculpture. It’s a metal sculpture with, I don’t know, about 60 points. That’s not an exaggeration. It has 60 sharp metal points.
Lisa: It’s a starburst.
Gabe: No, it is the thing that you use to defend the princess when your castle is being stormed.
Lisa: No, it’s just pointy, it’s just a pointy sculpture.
Gabe: You grab a hold of it with both hands, and in Braveheart, they fought off all of the invading knights. It will pierce armor people.
Lisa: It’s beautiful and probably the most expensive thing in my house.
Gabe: It weighs as much as Lisa.
Lisa: It does not. It’s pretty heavy, though, we had to go to a lot of trouble to hang it.
Gabe: It weighs a metric ton, you carry it with a horse and you joust with it, she likes it because she thinks it’s in Braveheart.
Lisa: No, I like it because it’s beautiful, but of course, the best sculpture is the one I have that looks like a bird and is made out of garden equipment.
Gabe: It looks like a rooster. She named it Warner.
Lisa: Doesn’t look like a rooster, just looks like a bird.
Gabe: Looks like a rooster.
Lisa: I do have eclectic decorating taste.
Gabe: But we didn’t get to do that this year. I never realized, Lisa, how meaningful these disagreements were. I want to let the audience know they were never like angry disagreements. Lisa doesn’t actually care how I decorate and I don’t care how Lisa decorates, this is.
Lisa: Overall, your decorating is fine, just really bland.
Gabe: OK, first off, what I want to say, I can’t because this show is PG-13, but it starts with an F. It just it starts with an F, lady. My decorating is phenomenal. And all from local
Lisa: Bland.
Gabe: Oh, I hate you so much. This stuff is missing. And on all of these adventures, we’ve discovered all of these things that we just didn’t even know existed. I did not know that you could make a bird out of metal garden tools and then paint it, I don’t know, teal, blue and orange. This thing is ugly.
Lisa: And purple. Teal, blue, and purple.
Gabe: Ugly.
Lisa: It’s awesome, I love it, I’ve had it for years, it’s gorgeous.
Gabe: Lisa is right, it is so ugly, it is flipped over into beautiful, it’s like those hideous dogs that are now cute. That’s what’s happened here. But we don’t have that. Lisa and I haven’t been able to discuss this at all because we didn’t go get new material to discuss. It’s the same way with my wife. It’s the same way with my friends. That’s what I remember about the last year. I used to think that all of these conversations were wasteful. They were just minutia that you used to fill your day. That’s the biggest thing that I’ve learned, that all of these boring, pointless conversations are actually the bedrock and the cornerstone and the foundation of your most meaningful relationships. I would give anything to spend an afternoon discussing what art I find beautiful that Lisa finds hideous.
Lisa: You know, this is an excellent point you’re making, it does always seem like these were random things and who cares? Because you have to fill the space. But you’re right, it is the stuff of life.
Gabe: It’s not even just the stuff of life, it’s not small talk, right? With a stranger. How are you, Gabe? I’m fine. Was machst du? Oh, I’ve got some errands to run. Well, what do you think of the weather? You don’t talk about how you hate each other’s clothes or art or taste or. That’s the kind of conversation that you have with your best friend. That’s the conversation you have with close family. That’s the conversations that you have with your spouse. And we just don’t have a lot of things to discuss right now because.
Lisa: Nothing’s happening.
Gabe: Yeah, because nothing’s happening. And we’ve gravitated toward things that frankly are not good conversation starters. You know, we spent more time complaining about politics. And listen, I think that political discourse and political discussion is extremely valuable. Disagreement does not equal disrespect. And knowing what’s going on in the world is I feel the responsibility of every American. But you’ve got to have a balance to that. For every 20 minutes that you spend complaining about the government, you should spend an hour discussing something that’s beautiful. You’ve got to have this balance. And unfortunately, politics didn’t slow down one iota. Everything else did. The counter balance has been disturbingly missing. All we can do is complain about what we’ve lost. And nobody is spending any time on anything that’s beautiful because there’s just not enough. You know, I joked, Lisa introduced to Gabe and Kendall the show Schitt’s Creek. We’d never watched it. We had no idea it existed.
Lisa: My husband found it randomly.
Gabe: Yeah, I’m serious when I say this, Schitt’s Creek saved my marriage. I’m not kidding. My wife and I binge watched all six seasons and my wife and I just loved it. And it was new. And because Lisa found it recently, that allowed us to discuss it, you know. What do you think of this episode? Well, I saw it this way. Well, I didn’t see it that way. And once again, for this brief, like six-week period, this minutia was back.
Lisa: Well, this is why the whole world stopped for Tiger King, because we were all in the perfect position to need something to talk about.
Gabe: Yes, yes, and if I learned anything this year, it’s that all of these little things that I take for granted. Well, that was a wasted day. I didn’t accomplish anything. It turns out that no, what I accomplished was actually amazing. I do have trouble connecting with people. I think the average person doesn’t understand me at all. And I often feel alone, even in a crowd of people. I feel alone and I question my value to society or the people around me. I question whether or not I’m doing any good. And there’s so many external factors. You have a podcast and you put your story out in the world. Some people think that that’s brave. Other people think that that’s arrogant. Some people think that you’re helping further a discussion about mental illness. Other people think that you’re bragging and oh, you think you’re so important that people want to hear your stupid life? What’s wrong with you? I’m constantly bombarded with this and I gravitate toward the negative.
LISA: You do. You do.
Gabe: If 100 people tell me they love me and one person tells me they hate me, I will follow the guy who hates me around and try to figure out why.
Lisa: You will. It’s really disturbing.
Gabe: It is. It’s depressing and the problem is, is that this past year, the 100 people have been gone because they’re taking care of themselves, they’re taking care of their families. They’re all trying to survive, just like all of us. Now, there’s just this constant negativity and nobody’s arguing about who’s artwork is bland, whose artwork is medieval weaponry.
Lisa: It’s beautiful, I’m telling you.
Gabe: And it may well be.
Lisa: Viroj likes it.
Gabe: Ok, well, that doesn’t help. Viroj is the most boring person we know. Your defense that it’s not bland.
Lisa: Again, Gabe, boring men hold down jobs, and that’s super sexy.
Gabe: You say boring, I say stability. I just
Lisa: To be fair, Viroj, you’re right, does not, in fact, have good taste. But we both like it. That’s the point.
Gabe: I love the felt tiger in your bedroom.
Lisa: Viroj found it, yeah, the amusing part is we paid like three dollars for the picture and then spent substantially more to get it framed.
Gabe: You overpaid for the picture. You know, all of these articles, they all end with something that I’ve learned. Some way that I feel that I have evolved in the last year, something to take away. And even sometimes that take away is not very flattering to me.
Lisa: Of the seven, five of them are negative.
Gabe: But they’re constructive. Constructive criticism for dear old Gabe. A hard look at my life, what I wish that I could remember, lessons that I wished I’d learned, the lesson that I’ve learned is that no time spent with your friends is wasted.
Lisa: Ok, that’s a good one.
Gabe: No time spent with your loved ones is wasted. We’re all sitting around trying to evaluate whether or not the time was efficient or good or well spent. It is. It just is. I can’t even begin to tell you the number of times that I met you for lunch. And we’d sit there and talk for two hours, usually over tortilla chips and salsa. And I think, oh, well, that was two hours. I’ll never get back. You know what a waste, right? Like.
Lisa: Thanks a lot.
Gabe: I don’t mean it mean, I just I would think of all of my honey do list, all of the chores, all the stuff that I had to do for work. And I was like, oh, I just wasted like two or three hours in the middle of the day. And then all the restaurants closed,
Lisa: Right.
Gabe: Remember? And they were closed here for like ten weeks.
Lisa: That was a real problem for Gabe, that was the thing he really missed the most.
Gabe: All of a sudden, I was like, that was not wasted time, you know, venting to my friend, listening to my friend, exchanging ideas with my friend, just sitting there drinking a Diet Coke and eating chips and salsa with my friend. It turns out that it had an extreme amount of value that was only recognizable once it was gone.
Lisa: Right.
Gabe: It kind of reminds me of that coworker that everybody thinks is lazy until the coworker goes on vacation.
Lisa: Gee, has that ever happened to you, Gabe?
Gabe: No, I never once thought you were lazy, I thought you were irresponsible.
Lisa: Many thanks. I think. That’s a little bit backhanded, but anyway.
Gabe: It should be a lot backhanded, I’m sad that you didn’t pick up on that.
Lisa: The other theme that runs through all of your birthday blogs is this idea that your life did not turn out the way that you expected. One of them actually says 20-year-old Gabe would look at me and be ashamed.
Gabe: I don’t know what 20-year-old Gabe is going to think of 44-year-old Gabe. It is an interesting thing, 20-year-old Gabe had really high expectations. Twenty-year-old Gabe did not expect to be twice divorced. Twenty-year-old Gabe did not expect to have all of these mistakes and regrets. 20-year-old Gabe fully expected to have six children and stay in the same job and really just garner respect from people. I think that 20-year-old Gabe would be most disappointed in the fact that I’m so easily dismissed. 20-year-old Gabe put a lot of value on integrity and commanding respect. While I feel that I have integrity, I don’t feel like I command respect. I’m so easily dismissed. I’m so easily ignored. I sit on so many panels where, well, we should probably get the patient’s voice, I guess.
Lisa: A lot of tokenism.
Gabe: I don’t think that 20-year-old Gabe ever thought that Gabe was going to be the token guy in the room? You know, I don’t think I would have known what tokenism was. It’s very probable that I would have sat on these boards and commanded a great deal of respect and talk about all the good that I was doing and have been completely unaware that I was marginalizing people because I would have seen things so much from my perspective. I’d like to think that I would have been open to listening. But, you know, 20-year-old Gabe had pretty high expectations and was awfully arrogant. I don’t want to paint myself as a bad guy. I don’t want to paint myself as somebody who was unkind or uncaring. But there was a lot that I didn’t understand. And being in this position has really allowed me to see the plight of marginalized people, because in some ways I’m a marginalized person. I do think that seeing the world for what it is has value. But, you know, ignorance is bliss. Ich weiß es nicht. Is the truth better or is respect better?
Lisa: The truth is always better. That’s why you take the red pill. The truth is always better.
Gabe: I sometimes I wish I could take the blue pill, Lisa.
Lisa: The reality is better. Truth has its own intrinsic value, there’s no need to debate this.
Gabe: The truth does have its own intrinsic value, but in The Matrix where the blue pill red pill comes from, there was the guy that sold out all of his friends to be put back in The Matrix and just live happily ever after because he just couldn’t take it anymore. Now, that guy was evil and he was wrong and he was a murderer. But if we’re arguing the philosophical basis of, look, I was going to live happily ever after. Ich weiß es nicht. It’s one of the things that makes the movie interesting for me. And while I’m so glad that they never made any more, I mean, the single standalone movie was really enough.
Lisa: I loved The Matrix, it was so ruined by the following movies, so ruined.
Gabe: What following? There was no following. I took the blue pills.
Lisa: Yeah.
Gabe: I understand that truth has its own intrinsic value and I am inclined to agree with you. And I’d like to believe that I’ve done a lot of good. But you and I both know that in most of the circles I run in, people don’t give people like me the credit for that good.
Lisa: You’re talking about how 20-year-old Gabe would feel about this, et cetera, what 20-year-old Gabe expected, but everybody always acts like there’s a time before diagnosis that you didn’t have bipolar disorder. You had bipolar; you just weren’t diagnosed. You were never mentally healthy. You always had bipolar disorder. You just were untreated. So, 20 year old Gabe didn’t know he had bipolar, but he did. And he did not expect that to ever change. He did not expect those symptoms to ever go away. He expected to always have that same internal state of the fluctuating mania and depression, the suicidality, the racing thoughts. None of that could have been pleasant. And twenty-year-old Gabe expected that to continue for the rest of his life because he thought that was normal and just the way humans are. So, when you say that twenty year old Gabe would be disappointed in the outcome now or he expected the following things that he didn’t get, well, yeah, but look at this amazing thing he got that he didn’t even know was out there. I know you’re speechless. A profound point. I know.
Gabe: Eh.
Lisa: You got to admit that you are more comfortable now in your own brain and you’re certainly happier because you’re no longer suicidal. So there you go. Twenty-year-old Gabe thought he would remain suicidal for the rest of his life. I don’t see how that’s not a major, major increase. He did not know that this level of wellness existed that you have achieved. You can’t tell me this isn’t better than when you were constantly thinking about suicide. And twenty-year-old Gabe didn’t even know that that was a possibility. Maybe you are imagining professional success, a large family, lots of children. But that would always have been overlaid with the racing thoughts and the wanting to die.
Gabe: I can’t argue with your logic, but I think you have to understand that 20-year-old Gabe was kind of a jackass.
Lisa: I know.
Gabe: You know, he was depressed, but he was also manic and grandiose. And I just I think maybe I just don’t want to get in an argument with him.
Lisa: You always use your birthday as a time to look back and in one of your blogs, you write the ghost of bipolar past win. You use this time to look back and say, oh, I didn’t do this, I didn’t do that. I’m so sad. I wanted this. I didn’t get that. Why? Why is that the thing that you do? Why is it not the looking back on wow, I never knew that you could just sit on your couch and not think about dying. That is so awesome. How come that’s never your thought process?
Gabe: I’m pessimistic by nature. It’s a fair question and it’s a reasonable question, and it’s one of the reasons that I always like to write these blogs all by myself and not involve you, because I don’t like to be challenged on my stupid thoughts. It’s hard to get out of the habit, right. I’m sincere when I say that I am better off today than I have been probably at any other point in my life. And I do recognize that logically, intellectually, I know that to be the case, but I don’t feel it.
Lisa: I can’t discount that, yeah, your feelings matter much more than logic sometimes. Your feelings are your reality. So, I don’t want to dismiss that outright. But you do see it, right? You do see.
Gabe: Oh, I can. There has never been a problem seeing it. It’s always been a feeling.
Lisa: Well, this is what CBT is for, you actually need to change your own internal thought processes and feelings.
Gabe: Seriously, are you telling me to go to therapy? Are you like, hey, Gabe, thanks for doing a birthday podcast, by the way, you should go to therapy? Like I never thought of that before. I’m going to just lose weight. I’m going to exercise more. I’m going to give forgiveness that I’ve been denying. I’m going to go skydiving, Rocky Mountain climbing, going to do something with a bull.
Lisa: I hate that song. I would not need to do all of that if I found out that I was terminally ill because I’m already a good person. I don’t need to get sick to suddenly realize I have poor morals. Also, why wasn’t he doing all this stuff before? I went skydiving. Why do you have to wait to find out you’re dying to go skydiving?
Gabe: I think it’s really just maybe an example of we put things off.
Lisa: You know how I live, like, completely not for the future ever? Boom, turns out I’m a genius.
Gabe: Yeah, yeah, when you can’t pay your mortgage, everybody agrees.
Lisa: Well, I have to admit, I do not have a fully funded retirement account, but my electronics are awesome.
Gabe: See, you always say that, but I have a fully funded retirement account and my electronics are all better than yours.
Lisa: Eh, matter of opinion. Also, that’s another thing I’ve really missed for the pandemic is traveling.
Gabe: Yeah, see, that’s what you should have gone with. You have shitty electronics, but, oh my God, you have so many stamps in your passport.
Lisa: Yeah, yeah, I will go with that.
Gabe: No, you can’t retroactively change it.
Lisa: Why not? Of course I can, I’m the editor.
Lisa: You’re always talking about how you’ve disappointed the expectations of 20-year-old Gabe, well, 20-year olds are all idiots. What about the expectations of 30-year-old Gabe or thirty-five-year-old Gabe or 40 year old Gabe? Have you met those expectations?
Gabe: I think that’s an incredibly valuable question, because 30-year-old Gabe was starting into recovery with bipolar disorder and thinking about stuff like buying a house, starting a business, getting a job, you know, just really reaching stability. But then, of course, we got divorced. And that was kind of a blow to my ego a little bit because I didn’t want to be divorced again. But then again, even through our divorce, I wanted to be in a stable relationship and I absolutely achieved this. It’s not a fluke. Kendall and I have been together for eight years. We celebrated eight years of marriage during a global pandemic. So, I feel this one is going to stick. So, yes, I think that 30-year-old, 35-year-old Gabe would probably be pretty damn proud of me.
Lisa: Oh, that’s wonderful.
Gabe: You know, he understood bipolar disorder. He didn’t know if I could make it. He’s kept the weight off. You know,
Lisa: Yeah, that’s a good point.
Gabe: Remember, 30-year-old Gabe was like, OK, well, you’ve got all the weight off. But, you know, there was always this big asterisk, like, look, everybody else we know that got this surgery, they gained all the weight back, dude. I never gained the weight back. I’m coming up on, what, year 17? And I’ve still kept the weight off. I bought the house. Hell, I, I even got the Lexus. I
Lisa: Yeah.
Gabe: Remember, you know, that was twenty-five-year-old Gabe that wrote that Lexus on the board. And I got it, I got the Rolex. I got the stable relationship, I pretty much got everything but children which you know, many people who want kids don’t have kids. That’s not really outside of the norm.
Lisa: The dog is already quite the burden to Aunt Lisa.
Gabe: That’s very true, but, yes, I think that’s a nice reframe, Lisa. I love reframing.
Lisa: Love the reframing.
Gabe: As you know. I don’t know why my birthday gets me. I think it’s because I feel that I’m chronically behind and I’m running out of time. I feel that I’ve lost so much time that I’ll never get it back. I feel like I always have more to do. And I’m not getting closer. I feel like I should have been further along, that I should have done more. And some of that is comparing myself to others. I, I.
Lisa: Well, let’s talk about reframing, you keep saying, oh, failure, failure, failure, unhappiness, what would it take for happiness? What would you need to have happen? You keep saying, oh, I haven’t met my goals. You know, you don’t actually have any clearly defined goals.
Gabe: That’s not true.
Lisa: Maybe that’s why you’re not meeting them.
Gabe: My goal is to be happy.
Lisa: Ok,
Gabe: My goal is to, OK, you ready?
Lisa: I’m ready.
Gabe: Here it is.
Lisa: This is very, I’m writing this down.
Gabe: Step one,
Lisa: Ok,
Gabe: Underpants. Step two. Step three, profit, I have learned from the underpants gnomes.
Lisa: (Laughter)
Gabe: Lisa, thank you. Thank you sincerely for hanging out with me on my birthday. It’s a cool thing to do. It is very, very cool that we are only five days apart. So, I want to extend a heartfelt and warm happy birthday to you.
Lisa: Thank you, Gabe. Happy birthday.
Gabe: You know, Lisa, what you should have said is that five days is where all the wisdom is kept. You know, you never remember your quote.
Lisa: You’re better at that.
Gabe: Ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for listening in. My name is Gabe Howard and I am the host of the Not Crazy podcast. And I’m the author of Mental Illness Is an Asshole, which you can get on Amazon.com. But if you head over to gabehoward.com, I will sign it. It will be cheaper and I’ll include a bunch of show swag. You want Not Crazy podcast stickers absolutely free? This is the way. Just head over to gabehoward.com. If you loved the show, please subscribe. Also use your words and tell other people why they should listen.
Lisa: Don’t forget the outtake after the credits, and we’ll see you next Tuesday.
Announcer: You’ve been listening to the Not Crazy Podcast from Psych Central. For free mental health resources and online support groups, visit PsychCentral.com. Not Crazy’s official website is PsychCentral.com/NotCrazy. To work with Gabe, go to gabehoward.com. Want to see Gabe and me in person? Not Crazy travels well. Have us record an episode live at your next event. E-mail show@psychcentral.com for details.
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